Barack Obama — natural born follower

In the “I wish I’d said that” department is this truly excellent post from Power Line, pointing out that this crisis (a) establishes that McCain, not Obama, is a leader and (b) that the Democrats cannot possibly be telling the truth when they try to blame McCain for the House’s inability to reach an agreement.  Indeed, I like the latter point so much, I’ll quote it here, although I really think you should read the whole post:

Hoping to cover for their “follower” of a presidential candidate, Democrats are claiming that McCain has done more harm than good in the legislative debate. Although this is always a possibility with McCain (and, indeed, just about anyone who is willing to lead), the Democrats’ case is absurd.

Their argument is that Congress was on the verge of a deal until McCain entered the picture and caused Republican House members to block it. The problems with this script are several. First, there is no evidence that House Republicans were ever on board with any deal. Second, the support of House Republicans is not needed to pass bailout legislation. The Democrats control the House.

The Democrats counter the second point by saying that a majority of House Dems won’t support a deal unless House Republicans provide “cover.” But this argument raises more questions than it answers. First, it is a serious condemnation of House Dems (too gutless to do what they think is right, even in the face of a potential economic meltdown). Second it is a serious condemnation of Nancy Pelosi (too ineffective to whip her troops into line even in the face of a potential economic meltdown). Third, it casts serious doubt on the wisdom of the deal that McCain is falsely accused of scuttling. If the deal made sense, House Dems wouldn’t believe they need “cover” from House Republicans.

Fourth, the “cover” argument shows what a non-factor Obama is in all of this. The Dems complain (preposterously) that McCain has riled up House Republicans or failed to bring them around. Meanwhile, no one seems to be asking why Obama hasn’t helped the House leadership obtain sufficient support from House Dems.

Be Sociable, Share!
  • Ozzie

    This is pretty interesting:

    “According to one GOP lawmaker, some House Republicans are saying privately that they’d rather “let the markets crash” than sign on to a massive bailout.

    “For the sake of the altar of the free market system, do you accept a Great Depression?” the member asked.

    President Bush’s lame duck status, and his heavy hand in dealing with lawmakers in his own party for the last seven-plus years, is also coming back to haunt the White House, as House Republicans grumble that Bush is “trying to tear up the Constitution” by committing the federal government to such a massive intervention in the U.S. financial markets.

    http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0908/13946.html

  • BrianE

    It was reported early on, before McCain went to Washington, that the democrats weren’t going to pass anything that McCain wouldn’t vote for. They weren’t going to provide cover for Republicans to then criticize the Democrats for this massive bailout.
    It was the Democrats that forced McCain to call their bluff and say, OK if I’m the point man, then so be it, I’m the point man.
    The fact that they then back away and criticized McCain for “injecting” himself in the process just demonstrates how duplicitous the Democrat leaders are.

    ABC News’ George Stephanopoulos reports that, if John McCain doesn’t vote for the Bush administration’s $700 billion economic bailout plan, it won’t pass.

    [snip]

    A Democratic leadership source says that White House Chief of Staff Josh Bolten has been told that Democratic votes will not be there if McCain votes no — that there is no deal if McCain doesn’t go along.

    [snip]

    And Democrats certainly aren’t going to go out on a limb without political cover and give McCain a chance to hang the “Socialist” anchor around them the next six weeks. Indeed, Nancy Pelosi has said as much.

    http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/archives/mccain_controls_bailouts_fate/

  • Ozzie

    The Wall Street Journal on what happens now:

    Democrats could decide to go ahead with their plan without Republicans. While this would ensure passage, it would essentially saddle Democrats with responsibility for a bailout package that has stirred up strong resistance among both Democrat and Republican voters — with elections just weeks away.
    [...]
    If Democrats are forced to move forward on their own, the party’s demands on the White House are sure to go up. Proposals that once seemed off the table — such as a plan to give bankruptcy judges authority to adjust mortgage terms — would likely gain new life. The prospects would also likely rise for Democratic proposals to stimulate the economy, such as new spending on roads and bridges and extended federal benefits for the unemployed.

    But they won’t want to do that because the bailout plan is unpopular (depending entirely on how it is explained and described to voters) so they need the support of Congressional Republicans in order to make sure Democrats facing reelection don’t have the albatross of bailing out Wall Street around their necks. This close to an election, it’s better to be obstructionist (while complaining about a do-nothing congress) than bold.

    Roll Call (in a special Friday edition!) on the negotiations:

    Senate Republicans are pissed at House Republicans and John McCain, for sabotaging the progress they made:

    Senate Budget ranking member Judd Gregg (R-N.H.) said he didn’t know whether the process would break down as a result of House Republicans.

    “I certainly hope that rational minds will take control of the process on both sides,” Gregg said. “The problem isn’t hypothetical. It’s real.”

    House Fanancial Services committee ranking Republican Spencer Bachus has now pissed off everyone because he acceded to the Dodd/Frank compromise and went to their little press conference and then he announced that House Republicans were rebelling. He was forced to put out a statement announcing that even though he was the ranking Republican involved in the negotiations, he did not represent House Republicans.

    Congress will probably be in session through the weekend, though the Senate’s schedule is “murky.” They still have to pass “a continuing resolution, a stimulus bill and the bailout.” Democrats might sneak the bailout into the CR, though that is a last resort move. Probably no votes today on anything.

    Mark Ambinder on whether this is McCain’s fault.

    Yes and no. He didn’t say a damn word to anyone during the Cabinet Room meeting. So he didn’t bring up the John Boehner/House Republicans plan, and he didn’t attack the Paulson deal. He is “urging all sides to come together.”

    But Boehner and the White House — and McCain — if they want to get something passed — do have the responsibility to persuade these Republicans to support the bailout .

    After all, if not to get these recalcitrant Republicans on board, why did McCain go to Washington in the first place?

    So he’s doing nothing, at all, except providing political cover to Republicans who don’t want to vote for this.

  • Ozzie

    Think McCain is a country first guy, if you wish. Think one party is patriotic while the other is treasonous/stupid etc.

    It’s all political posturing and it’s all ridiculous.

    This deification of one candidate and politcal party and demonization of the other (regardless which party you consider “your team”) makes everyone miss the bigger picture.

  • suek
  • suek
  • Ozzie

    From Aug, 2008 (The author thought the crash would occur after the election, but he understood that a crash was coming, and that both Obama and McCain received donations with expectations attatched):

    . . The truth is that the campaigns of both Barack Obama and John McCain are being inundated with cash from more or less exactly the same gorgons of the corporate scene. From Wall Street to the Big Oil powerhouses to the military-industrial complex, America’s fat-cat business leaders know that the Animal House-style party of the last eight years that made almost all of them rich with bonuses, government contracts and bubble profits is about to come to an end, and someone is going to have to pay to clean up the mess. They want that someone to be you, not them, and they’ve spared no expense to make sure both presidential candidates will be there to bail them out next year.

    They’re succeeding. Both would-be presidents have already sold us out. They’ve taken the money and run — completing the cyclical transformation of the American political narrative from one of monopolistic Republican iniquity to an even more depressing tale about the overweening power of corporate money and the essentially fictitious nature of our two-party system.

    In layman’s terms, we’ve gone from being screwed to being fucked. Who knows — maybe Barack Obama will surprise us if he wins the election. But if you look at the money, it doesn’t look good. * (* According to NPR. “Obama has raised $10 million from the men and women of Wall Street. McCain’s take is somewhat less: about $7 million” http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=94699066 )

    Thanks in part to the dormant FEC, corporate America has had even easier access to the candidates than usual in its effort to buy off the next government before the crash. . .

    http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/story/22210615/candidates_for_sale

  • BrianE

    This deification of one candidate and politcal party and demonization of the other (regardless which party you consider “your team”) makes everyone miss the bigger picture.

    Ozzie this is getting old. No one is deifying John McCain, and as adults, I suspect everyone has differences with some aspect of McCain’s agenda.
    But I think we all recognize that he represents the best chance to reign in government excess while Obama represents the best chance to force us all to the government trough. That trough is already too crowded!
    We can agree that neither are perfect, but the differences they represent are so stark, the consequences so potentially devastating makes the choice simple.
    This is an imperfect world– this isn’t heaven and perfection isn’t one of the choices.

  • Ozzie

    No one is deifying John McCain- Brian

    Sure they are. They believe that his actions have been selfless and he’s ony concerned with putting country first.

    Partisan Democrats do the same with Obama.

    “But I think we all recognize that he represents the best chance to reign in government excess . . ” Brian

    Based on what? Are you reading articles from across the political spectrum? Or are you reading things that reinforce what you think you know?

    People said the same about Bush and look what happened.

    The same people behind Bush are backing McCain/Palin.

  • suek

    >>The same people behind Bush are backing McCain/Palin.>>

    Well, duh. They _are_ in the same political party. They theoretically have the same basic principles. At the same time, people within the same party _don’t_ necessarily adhere to the same exact ideas.

    Do you expect each person to be his or her own political party?

    >>Are you reading articles from across the political spectrum? >>

    Do you have something to offer that indicates that McCain was _not_ a fiscal conservative?

    Just exactly _WHAT_ do you want from the president??

  • BrianE

    Ozzie,
    This is the definition of deify.
    Deify
    1 a: to make a god of b: to take as an object of worship
    2: to glorify as of supreme worth

    This is one of my fundamental problems with trying to have a discussion with liberals. They make words mean whatever they want.

    McCain represents the best chance to reign in government expense, compared to Obama. Don’t be so obtuse.

    From the Democrat website. This is the best shot they can level at McCain and earmarks:

    But John McCain has a problem. Aid to Israel is an earmark. As reported by thinkprogress.org, “congressional directives specifying spending amounts that are the same as shown in the Administration’s illustrative listing for country distributions also are regarded as earmarks. Annual earmarks for economic and military aid to Israel and Egypt are examples of such directives.”

    This is reality:

    What is broken in Washington? In order to get our troops $1.7 million for body armor, we have to allow congress to pick our pockets to the tune of $28.6 million to take back to their states to basically buy votes!

    John McCain earmarks life time $0
    Sara Palin earmarks last year $27 million.
    Barak Obama earmarks last year $311 million
    Joe Biden earmarks this year $120 million
    But Obama just doesn’t get it. He voted for this crap!
    According to the New York Daily News, congress also found room in the the Defense Department Appropriations Act of 2006 to fund the following:
    $25 million to a “multispecies fish hatchery” in Montana to increase stocks of pike and walleye for warm water fishing.
    $1.8 million for Los Angeles sixth-graders who are “disrespectful, have poor grades and don’t obey rules.”
    $500,000 for curling, dog mushing, snowboarding and a snowshoe biathlon at Alaska’s Arctic Winter Games.
    $242,000 for South Carolina’s National Wild Turkey Federation to show American hunters how to conserve the wildlife habitat of the turkey.
    $200,000 to a group called Weed-It-Now Taconic to rid upstate New York of the Japanese knotweed.
    $850,000 for an educational initiative at the Fort Des Moines Museum in Iowa. “The museum says that Ronald Reagan learned to ride horses at an old cavalry post on the site in 1937. The funds will create “substantive programming.””

    In fact, according to the Daily News, the total score for congress on this one is “a record-breaking 2,966 pork-barrel projects for their home districts at a cost of $11.1 billion”.

    The bill also budgets $1.7B to armor for the troops.

  • suek

    >>Sure they are. They believe that his actions have been selfless and he’s ony concerned with putting country first.

    Partisan Democrats do the same with Obama.>>

    So what? We make judgements based on people’s past actions.

    You have some other candidates we can consider???

  • Ozzie

    Do you expect each person to be his or her own political party? – suek

    I’m saying that people who vote for McCain/Palin expecting “change” are drinking the Kool-Aid.

    “Do you have something to offer that indicates that McCain was _not_ a fiscal conservative?’ -suek

    He’s going to follow in George Bush’s foortsteps, who said he was a fiscal conservative and was anything but.

    Just exactly _WHAT_ do you want from the president??” – suek

    I think the system is broken and that both parties have been bought and paid for.

    I’d like for Presidents to level with the public, and work FOR the public (as opposed to special interests) and stop the B.S. and actually put country first. We havent had that for decades and things seem to be getting worse.

    If Bush/Cheney didnt wake citizens up, I dont know what will . Maybe President Palin?

  • BrianE

    He’s going to follow in George Bush’s foortsteps, who said he was a fiscal conservative and was anything but.

    And you have that on what authoritative source? Tarot cards?
    And please, not the talking points he voted with Bush 90% of the time. Human and pig DNA are 99% the same, but the differences are obvious and real.

    I think the system is broken and that both parties have been bought and paid for.

    Talking about Campaign Finance Reform this was said in 2001:
    “For all of these reasons and more, voters intuitively agree with Sen. John McCain (R-Ariz.) when he says that the system is broken and cries out for reform.”

    http://www.enterstageright.com/archive/articles/0401mf.htm

    More on John McCain and government reform.
    http://www.ontheissues.org/2008/John_McCain_Government_Reform.htm

    I think McCain-Feingold was the wrong approach and I disagree with McCain on this, but there is no arguing that McCain has a record of trying to reform government. He worked consistently for the line item veto. Some day he might even come around to term limits.
    But the point is he has a record of reform. Obama talks about it, McCain has DONE it.
    McCain has worked with Democrats to pass legislation (much to the chagrin of some Republicans). Obama, don’t know because he has spent so little time there.
    Let Obama serve in the senate for 12 years, and demonstrate a record. Then we can talk about Obama.

  • Ozzie

    Let Obama serve in the senate for 12 years, and demonstrate a record. Then we can talk about Obama.- Brian

    Like I said, Palin was the reason I decided to vote for Obama.

    I live in a swng state and I was “polled” yesterday. They wanted to know if abortion was a deciding factor me me (it isnt). The fact that I cringe whenever Palin opens her mouth, along with her link to some very bizarre preachers (who make Jerimiah Wright look like something out of a Norman Rockwell painting) are key.

    But the reason I dont think McCain wil be a fiscal conservative is the cost of the 700 some bases the U.S has around the world, along with the enormous cost of the war in Iraq means that we’ll continue to run up deficits and be dependant upon China to float our debt.

    We’ve been weaked economically, militarily and in terms of soft power, too.
    And I think we’re in trouble regarldess who wins the White House.

    Obama may help us in terms of “soft power,” but, for me, McCain’s credibilty and his “commitment to country” became laughable the day he picked Palin.

  • BrianE

    Ozzie said:

    But the reason I dont think McCain wil be a fiscal conservative is the cost of the 700 some bases the U.S has around the world, along with the enormous cost of the war in Iraq means that we’ll continue to run up deficits and be dependant upon China to float our debt.

    Are you suggesting that Obama is going to close those 700 bases and bring the military home? Where has he said that?
    And doesn’t Obama intend on sending troops from Iraq to Afghanistan and turn up the effort there? What will be the net savings of that?
    And do you really think an Obama presidency with Democrats porking up every bill that crosses the president’s desk will have the courage to resist spending increases above the levels he has proposed.
    If you do, you really need to take a reality check.
    So my question to you, how much will this new military of Obama’s save us? And how much will his new intiative for a civilian corp which he said would rival the military cost?

    Are you suggesting that Obama would be more fiscally conservative than McCain?

    The war in Iraq is winding down. The difference between Obama and McCain is philosophy. You never signal to the enemy your plans. Giving the enemy a date certain allows them to adjust their strategy. Remember, the difference between our mindset and our enemies is our scale of time.
    Americans are unable to develop a long-term strategy for nearly anything, which is why the Chinese have an advantage over us as it relates to trade.

  • Ozzie

    Are you suggesting that Obama is going to close those 700 bases and bring the military home? Where has he said that?- Brian

    Nope. I’m saying that neither candidate wil be a fiscal conservative and that we’ll keep borrowing billions a day to keep afloat until we can’t any longer.

    “So my question to you, how much will this new military of Obama’s save us?”- Brian

    I never said that ther wil be a “new military of Obama’s”.. the chronic waste will continue regardless who is president.

    The U.S.A. cannot afford to keep it up, however. We’re all about to pay the price.

  • Ozzie

    The war in Iraq is winding down- Brian

    Wer’e not leaving and never planned on leaving. The embassy we’ve built, which is larger than the Vatican, (along with the huge bases equipped with movie theaters and bolwing alleys and swimming pools and their own rail systems), will continue to cost us billions, along with more than 700 military bases worldwide.

  • suek

    The military budget is something like 5-7% of the budget. You have a problem with that?

  • Ymarsakar

    along with more than 700 military bases worldwide.

    Guess how much buying a nation like America or acquiring superpower status would cost, Oz.

  • Ymarsakar

    I’m saying that neither candidate wil be a fiscal conservative and that we’ll keep borrowing billions a day to keep afloat until we can’t any longer.

    A “fiscal conservative” that wants to defund the military of its first line defense of America is only a “fiscal conservative” in Oz’s mind.

  • Ymarsakar

    Like I said, Palin was the reason I decided to vote for Obama.

    That actually says a lot about where your prejudices and biases are, Oz.

    It also supports my claim that your “fiscal conservatives” are nothing like real fiscal conservatives, for example Sarah Palin. You don’t vote for responsible government spending because your candidates can’t spend responsibility and you don’t even expect them to. Now that’s nihilism: things are bad and people won’t make it better, so let’s tear it down further by destroying the real fiscal conservatives.

  • Ymarsakar

    Another thing that makes for interesting logic play is that while you complain about the budget, you have already told us that it matters not a dime to you in comparison to the worth you find in Democrat propaganda aimed towards assassinating Sarah Palin’s character.

    700 bases that the US can’t complain? You don’t care about that.

  • Ymarsakar

    He’s going to follow in George Bush’s foortsteps, who said he was a fiscal conservative and was anything but.

    Bush said he was a compassionate conservative. How many filters do you need to absorb Democrat propaganda before it actually starts making sense, Oz?

    Wondering if I could setup a temporary filter system just as layered.

    And doesn’t Obama intend on sending troops from Iraq to Afghanistan and turn up the effort there? What will be the net savings of that?

    Haven’t you gotten the fact that Oz doesn’t care about the “net savings” because Oz thinks America is going down anyways, regardless of who is elected, Obama or McCain? Might as well throw some fire on the burning of the Library of Alexandria if you can’t save it, right Brian?

  • Ozzie

    The military budget is something like 5-7% of the budget. You have a problem with that?- suek

    The U.S. spends a trillion dollars a year on its military establishment, not including defense appropriation.

    When added to the amount we spend on nuclear weapons (which is in the dept of energy’s budget) , veteran affairs (the Department of veteran affairs), foreign military aid (the State Department), and the amount spent on the department of Homeland security, it is unsusatainable, especially as the dollar loses its value.

    Things are about to change in the U.S.A regardless who is president.

    I used to like and admire John McCain. But President Palin? No thanks.

  • Ymarsakar

    I used to like and admire John McCain. But President Palin? No thanks.

    Fear mongery. Proof that Oz’s judgment on McCain was way out of kilter when the harsh reality of Dem propaganda impedes when convenient.

  • Ozzie

    That actually says a lot about where your prejudices and biases are, Oz- Yamr

    Some of the people on NRO are waking up ti this scary fact, too. Ymar. She doesnt have the chops.

    Kathleen Parker called on Palin to drop out of the race:

    “. . . Only Palin can save McCain, her party, and the country she loves. She can bow out for personal reasons, perhaps because she wants to spend more time with her newborn. No one would criticize a mother who puts her family first. Do it for your country.

    http://article.nationalreview.com/?q=MDZiMDhjYTU1NmI5Y2MwZjg2MWNiMWMyYTUxZDkwNTE=

  • Ymarsakar

    Some of the people on NRO are waking up ti this scary fact, too. Ymar.

    They woke up the the scary fact of Iraq breaking the hold Democrats have on their serfs, too. That’s not too surprising given Palin’s potential to upset their little plantation system.

  • Ymarsakar

    You got to be kidding me. Dems and NRO people wanting McCain to drop Palin cause “she doesn’t have the chops”. Please don’t underestimate people’s wisdom by defending the patriotism and loyalty of Democrats over their partisan interests.

    Guess the Democrats know what’s best for the country, like Obama, and they know who is best for Obama to run against for President too. Not Palin, obviously.

  • Ozzie

    Dems and NRO people wanting McCain to drop Palin cause “she doesn’t have the chops”. – Ymar

    I’m not bringing in the Democrats whatsoever, Ymar.

    The “Palin is in over her head” chorus among Conservatives is growing.

  • suek
  • suek
  • Ymarsakar

    I’m not bringing in the Democrats whatsoever, Ymar.

    That invalidates NRO then. A lone minority with an axe to grind has no credibility on calls for their opponents to make things easier for them by dropping Sarah.

  • Ymarsakar

    chorus among Conservatives is growing.

    Like I said before, your idea of what a “conservative” is, let alone a fiscal conservative, is pretty null and void by now.

  • Mike Devx

    It’d be cool to give Ozzie credit for reasonable postings. I don’t agree with him at all – well, occasionally I do – but isn’t this exactly the good kind of commentary “from the other side” that we like to see here? I think so, so I’d like to toss out a ‘Thank you’ to him for the quality of his tone and the fact that I see only partisanship and no deception in his opinions.

    Now if only he’d experience that epiphany that I keep waiting for! ;-)

  • SGT Dave

    All,
    I think Ozzie has some points; but he fails miserably when he talks about the “military establishment”. Yes, there are 700 military postings outside the US; a majority of these are Marine Detachments. For the non-military, that means Embassy Guards. Marines are cheaper than contractors, more efficient, and much meaner. Yes, there is a swimming pool (actually two) on Camp Victory – they were built by a guy named Sadaam Hussein. Same for the bowling alley there. There are less amenities at the remote bases, though this is improving.
    The buildings are a vital support for morale; to a lesser extent they make it possible for the military to have a smaller supply footprint – we don’t have to issue soap, shampoo, deodorant, or new underwear. You use your incidentals allowance for that. You can even get a bag of Doritos and a Mountain Dew and pretend you are home (except for the dust, the heat, and the strange outlets) if you get a precious day off.
    Military spending also covers those Guard/Reserve armories, retired benefits, and we spent an extra hundred million or so in support of that whole hurricane thing a few years back in Louisiana (and now in Texas). Don’t forget the 40 million for California wildfire support (just one year). It adds up.
    I’d take the bases out of Germany, personally, and move them to Poland, Romania, and any of the other new allies that actually act like allies. Unfortunately, they won’t do that; too much inertia.
    The military is a large item in the budget, but we spend a far smaller part of our GDP by percentage than many nations. It would destroy the economy of Germany and France if they footed their own defence costs. We need to cut off the freeloaders without compromising our interests. But again, that is politically dangerous.
    And are you counting the current aid to Africa under military efforts? The majority of the funding and implementation is happening through the military – military doctors, security, and portable medical facilities.
    Anyhow, I don’t like my choices, but I know which one is worse. And Palin is not the presidential candidate – she’s the VP. I feel more confident with her than with Joe “open mouth insert foot” Biden one heartbeat away from the most important job in the world.

    SSG Dave – “Cthulu for President – Stop Voting for the Lesser Evil and Go for the Elder Evil.”

  • Ymarsakar

    but isn’t this exactly the good kind of commentary “from the other side” that we like to see here?

    Oz doesn’t see Oz as the “other side”. So that’s not a relevant point with me. Since Oz continues to deny my comments concerning Oz’s Leftist resources and Democrat propaganda based political conclusions and predictions, I won’t make another claim based upon Oz is from the “other side” and has done good on politeness until Oz actually accepts that Oz’s info is from the “other side”.

    Other people here have other problems with Oz that I don’t have anything to do with.

  • Ymarsakar

    And are you counting the current aid to Africa under military efforts?

    Oz mentioned something about foreign aid as part of Oz’s sentiments over how America is getting worn out.

    Isolationism is the watch word of the day.

  • Ozzie

    Since Oz continues to deny my comments concerning Oz’s Leftist resources and Democrat propaganda based political conclusions and predictions, I won’t make another claim based upon Oz is from the “other side” and has done good on politeness until Oz actually accepts that Oz’s info is from the “other side”.- Ymar

    Ymar. When you suggest that NRO is part of Democrat/Leftist propaganda, I’m left speechless.

    When I think of what “Conservative” used to mean, particularly regarding smaller government and fiscal restraint, I think the term has lost much of its meaning.

  • Ozzie

    And are you counting the current aid to Africa under military efforts?

    Oz mentioned something about foreign aid as part of Oz’s sentiments over how America is getting worn out.

    Isolationism is the watch word of the day.- Ymar

    I mentioned foreign aid as a portion of The United States’ overall spending.

    The U.S government is borrowing close to $3 billion a day just to keep afloat. We’re becoming increasingly dependent on foreign governments. I dont know if you read the foreign press, but the world is now openly mocking our “superpower status.”

  • Ozzie

    I think so, so I’d like to toss out a ‘Thank you’ to him for the quality of his tone and the fact that I see only partisanship and no deception in his opinions.

    Now if only he’d experience that epiphany that I keep waiting for! – Mike

    Well, Thanks Mike.

    I’m actually not a “he” (Ozzie is one of my dog’s names). And, as someone who was raised Catholic, I have epiphanies on a regular basis.

    I will never see Sarah Palin the way people who embrace her do, however.

  • Ozzie

    Yes, there is a swimming pool (actually two) on Camp Victory – they were built by a guy named Sadaam Hussein. Same for the bowling alley there. There are less amenities at the remote bases, though this is improving.- SGT Dave

    Hi SGT Dave,

    I was referring to a documentary I watched, which said that there were five mega-bases, which proved, despite Donald Rumsefled’s constant assertions otherwise, that we never planned to leave Iraq ( I dont remember all of their names but Camp Anaconda comes readlly to mind).

    The documentary also pointed to ways in which the contractor (KBR) was actuallty rewarded for over-spending.

    If I can remember the name or find it, I’ll post it and you can tell me if anything is not factual.

    But this footage of the Embassy in Iraq bothers me. Is this really necessary?

    http://video.msn.com/video.aspx?mkt=en-us&vid=6e6be9cd-7970-4b85-a011-be8cd0b99402&fg=rss&from=34

  • Ymarsakar

    I will never see Sarah Palin the way people who embrace her do, however.

    The closing of the American mind is not an unexpected byproduct of power politics by ideological extremists.

    The documentary also pointed to ways in which the contractor (KBR) was actuallty rewarded for over-spending.

    None of that has anything to do with your concerns. There’s a big difference between worrying about adequate financial practices and wanting to solve “problems” by not funding it at all.

    To a person that wants the US to cut Iraq’s throat, it doesn’t matter who is spending what or how, so long as they stop spending it.

    It is a fundamental and mutually exclusive point of philosophy.

    We’re becoming increasingly dependent on foreign governments. I dont know if you read the foreign press, but the world is now openly mocking our “superpower status.”

    It’s not like you are willing to stick with the solutions to that “problem”: problems in your estimation, of course.

  • Mike Devx

    Ozzie #41

    I’m actually not a “he” (Ozzie is one of my dog’s names). And, as someone who was raised Catholic, I have epiphanies on a regular basis.

    Well, crap. I hate wiping egg off my face. As to epiphanies, the one I’m waiting for is the one I suffered through in 2001: My god, the liberals genuinely are harming this country. Conservatism may have its faults – as no “ism” is ever perfect – but they are insignificant compared to the harm that most modern liberal policies are causing. The Democrat party of Truman and JFK is gone.

    I will never see Sarah Palin the way people who embrace her do, however.

    That’s not the epiphany I’m hoping for! ;-)

    Perhaps watching the Democrats give a standing, cheering ovation to Barney Frank will cause the epiphany? The man demonstrates horrendous judgment, disqualifying him completely for public office. And the Democrats have, again, giving him a standing, cheering ovation. I could understand not being harshly ciritical of someone on your own side, but these cheering ovations are ridiculous.

  • Ozzie

    I could understand not being harshly ciritical of someone on your own side, but these cheering ovations are ridiculous- mike

    I used to be a Democrat, until I couldnt just didnt want to be associated, in any shape or form, with the party.

    But I dont like today’s Republicans, either.

    So I’m a registered Independent, which means that I’m a “hold my nose and push the button” kind of voter.

  • Zhombre

    Well, Ozzie, I empathize. I was a chronic Democrat voter too, voted for Slick Willie twice, and think of myself as an Indie now. But you can only hold your nose so long. Eventually you must be for something and some candidate.

  • Ymarsakar

    Oz’s still backing Obama because of Palin, so that’s being for something, Zhombre.